Neto

On 3/23/2024 at 10:30 AM, larryl said:

A broken wire in the harness can cause strange issues as they can occasionally make contact and work...

I had to replace the harness  

^^^

What I have seen in comparing the strand count on wires of the same gauge, across a span of 47 years (my 1946 Plymouth compared to a 93 Chrysler T&C) is that they used a much higher strand count wire on the older car, when compared to the later model one.  More strands = greater ability to withstand repeated flexing.  And about the only place where there was more or less constant flexing on the old car was in the engine harness.  Incidentally, however, that's also where I saw the most wire failure in the 93. I would have expected to find it in the door to body harnesses.  But come to think of it, I'm not sure I did a strand count on those wires on the 93.  Should do that sometime, because they just may have used high strand count wire in those constant flex areas.

On 2/20/2016 at 8:10 PM, Neto said:

1962 Chrysler Newport 361 ci

1972 Dodge Coronet 318

* 1946 Plymouth Special Deluxe (never drove it yet - still partially restored)

* 1949 Plymouth Special Deluxe (first series 49 - P15 model, parts car)

1980 Datsun (wife's car when we got married)

1984 VW Voyage (Brazilian alcohol model, like American VW Fox)

1993 Chrysler Town & Country (family car, later used by my son)

1998 Dodge Neon (car for my daughter)

1998 Chevy S-10 (work vehicle)

2000 Chrysler Town & Country (later as work car)

* 2009 Dodge Journey (current family car)

* 2010 Dodge Grand Caravan (current work vehicle)

* vehicles I/we still have

Two to add:

One off-brand, our 'new to us' family car (AKA, my wife's car): 2019 Honda CR-V

2019 Ram Classic.

(Need to sell: the Grand Caravan and/or the Journey)

I also see that I failed to mention the 75 Dodge Dart slant-six I bought, and later gave to my oldest son.  (Needs some repair work, and currently not tagged.)

Just be very careful about static electricity while dismantling that system.  (When I was scrapping out a 93 Chrysler T&C, the manual had dire warnings about what could happen if you accidentally set it off.  I DID manage to pull it w/o setting it off, so I do not know from experience how bad it would be.)

No help, but I feel your pain.  Our 2009 started with these same "idiot lights" coming on early last Summer.  It spent 7 weeks in & out of a local shop, we paid them a wad, and they couldn't fix it.  My wife lost her confidence in the car, so we purchased a newer used vehicle .  (She insisted that it not be another MoPar, so I won't say what it is.)  I've driven it around 1,500 miles since then - with all of these lights still on, and it runs and drives fine.  (Our case is possibly different, because this Journey is the base model, and never had cruise, which you loose automatically anytime the ABS system is not working.  So that made no difference.  This shop replaced several sensors, as well as the PCM, all to no advantage.  Except to them, and the parts stores....)

On 7/14/2021 at 4:46 PM, tsteves5 said:

 

There's a decent YouTube video here that shows this job and how to deal with the electrical and transmission connectors

 

 

 

The video was helpful, because just from the picture alone, it was my impression that this was accessed from the transmission pan, on the bottom side.

9 hours ago, DodgeaWrench said:

....

"What did you use to clean up the old "glue"?" 

On the replacement, from a salvage yard window, lightly wetting the window with soapy water, I used a razor blade to scape all the old adhesive off, down to the glass.  On the tailgate, it is recommended to leave thin layer of the old adhesive in place.  (It is a very good surface to bond to, and if it were to be scrapped off completely, that would greatly increase the likelihood on scratching the paint/rust.)  I didn't measure, but lets just say the old adhesive on the tailgate after broken glass removal was 1/2" high.  Using a razor blade, I sliced it down to 1/16"-ish high, being careful not to gouge or remove in entirely.  That last picture, before the glass was installed is the 'old' adhesive strip that was cut down.  A razor blade slides through the old adhesive like butter.

....

That is interesting to know.  The glue/adhesive on the one I tried to clean off (93 Chrysler T & C - 2nd Gen) was not like that.  It held onto the razor knife blade - too sticky still.  Maybe if I had tried to do it when it was really cold?  I don't know, but it was really a chore getting it off.

On 4/16/2023 at 10:34 PM, DodgeaWrench said:

I ended up purchasing the replacement window from Ernies Auto Parts in Harrison Township MI.  They sell recycled parts, are in my neighborhood, and until now I didn't even know they existed.  Friendly, helpful, and same price.  If I have a need, I'd definitely go back.

I agree with Neto, if I had to remove the glass from a u-pull salvage yard, I wouldn't do it.  I'd probably break it too.

 

The "laminated" shattered window held up, without leaks, for the 6 weeks until the weather warmed up.

 

Yesterday I took out the old and put in the new.  It wasn't bad at all.  As mentioned earlier, I followed the Chris Fix youtube video step by step, and used the 3m primer and 3m Windo-Weld as in the video.

My only recommendation would be to NOT use 4"+ suction cups from Harbor Freight.  The glass has no flat surface area and the cups were too large to get a secure grip anywhere on the curved glass surface.

 

The only thing left to do is snap the interior tailgate panels back in.  I'll wait a week or so to check for leaks first.  ...and the rear wiper.

 

 

 

Shattered window held in place with packing tape (both sides)

 

 

Cleaned up and prepped replacement glass

 

 

Broken window removed

 

Tailgate prepped, ready for 3M primer and 3M Windo-Weld

 

 

Replacement window set in place

 

 

 

 

 

 

What did you use to clean up the old "glue"?

On 3/19/2023 at 12:14 PM, DodgeaWrench said:

The salvage yard quoted $100 (privacy tint w/heat), 3M window weld $28, 3M primer $46, and daubers $9.  I've got razor blades, scrapers, and suctions cups.  So far under just under $200.  Local glass repair quoted $415.00 to have it done. 

As the same window was used for many years, my guess is there are many available and if I spent the energy to search further it could be had for less (but I doubt I will). 

With Easter on the horizon, if my make shift laminated window holds up, I'm thinking mid-April .  Hopefully Spring gets here by then.

 

I also prefer to do repairs myself if at all possible, but after attempting to remove the hatch window from a 93 Chrysler T & C, I'd not try it again.  I was using a razor knife, then a serrated knife once I got a bit of clearance, but if the two surfaces touched, it was stuck again.  Then in the process of trying to keep them apart, I pried on it too much, and it shattered.  With a broken one, I'd probably do the clean up myself,  but I wouldn't try to pull one at a salvage, unless someone can tell what the secrete is.  Spray in dish soap?  But then everything is slippery....  (I have replaced a side window in another T & C, a 2000, and removed all of the side glass from that 93 T & C w/o breaking any, but the rear window and the windshield, those came out in pieces.)

Update:

I still have the 09 Journey.  Registration ran out in November, so I had to make a decision quickly.  The "off-brand" 2019 we bought is an AWD, and came new M&S tires, but my wife doesn't trust anything but Blizzaks.  The salesman on this deal was extremely knowledgeable, and we were both impressed with his manner.  But the one thing he told us that my wife won't accept is that you almost cannot get this car stuck in snow, even if you try to.  So I put the Blizzaks back on the Journey, while trying to find the preferred steel wheels for the Honda CRV.  Apparently they were never offered, and I cannot even find any after-market steel wheels for this vehicle.  Bought some used alloys, but wanted to clean off the salt corrosion and repaint, and it's COLD here in Ohio, so we're using the Journey for winter driving for the time being.  So that explains why the Journey is still in my "stable".  (Also, I wanted to be sure that it wouldn't fail catastrophically right away after selling it, and it also has an outstanding recall on it.)

So here's the actual update on the Journey.  About a week ago the ESP and BAS lights came on, and stay on.  I don't have a code reader - borrowed one before - so I don't know what codes it's throwing.  I've read other threads here about the ESP light coming on, and the car won't go out of Park.  Nothing like that here.  I should also say that the wheels on which the snow tires are mounted do not have the fancy sensor valve stems.  (But these lights didn't come on until well after I installed those wheels.)

So these lights stay on all of the time, but I haven't noticed any difference at all in the way the car runs or drives.  It's just those lights.

So should I expect it to suddenly do like the other guy's car, and either not run, or not go out of park?  This Electronic Stability Program (ESP) Indicator Light / Brake Assist System (BAS) malfunction, does it just result in a more 'manual, old-timish' braking and steering scenario, where the ABS and features like stop working, or is it more dangerous than that?  (I already said in previous posts that most of my driving experience has been on vehicles w/o any of that stuff, and actually think that for people who learned to drive on vehicles like that, you actually have better control of the vehicle w/o ABS.  Like trying to slow down when the right side wheels are on snow or ice, and only the left side is on clear pavement.  I don't want to start an argument about that - just saying that for me personally, I have better control of a vehicle w/o ABS than one with it.)  My concern as to this malfunction creating a dangerous situation is mostly due to the fact that our daughter is in the hospital due to complications of their twins' upcoming birth, and so we often use this car to transport their 19 month old.  (Taking care of him most days, so our son-in-law can keep working, and spend time with our daughter in the hospital.  It is now 4 weeks that she's been there.)

I have a 46 Plymouth, and yes, of course it is 6 volt, so much larger gauge wire everywhere.  I also had a 93 Chrysler T&C that I scrapped out after the Rust devil got it.  I found various places where the wires were broken in the 93, especially in the engine harness, where movement of the engine results in constant flexing.  I have compared the wiring in the two vehicles, gauge for gauge, and the difference, and the key in the case of wires that sustain daily flexing, is the strand count.  The finer the strands, the more flexible they are, and the longer it will take before that flexing results in broken wires.  (For an extreme example, compare automobile wire to stranded wire used in buildings where conduit is required.  The building wire is available at a significantly lower cost, but the strand count is much lower for the same gauge.  Very stiff in comparison.)

I definitely get it about all of the computerized bells & whistles.  I don't even care for the electric stuff, like power window winders.  I know how to roll a window up & down, no problem.  Personally, having learned to drive w/o even power brakes etc, I also have a strong dislike for ABS.  Our small street empties out on a larger street on a fairly steep down-hill slope.  When there is heavy snow fall, the township usually only gets the center of our street cleared.  So descending to the stop sign, the right wheels are both on packed snow, while only the left wheels have traction.  So the ABS senses that the right wheels are sliding while the left side wheels are still rotating, and shuts down the brakes.  So then you just go right on down the hill into the cross traffic.  My wife just takes the long route, out the other way.  (I do find that it stops better if I put it into neutral going down that hill.  Something about having the main braking wheels - the front - being the powered wheels as well just doesn't help vehicle control on slippery surfaces.  The wheels that are expected to do the majority of the braking are trying to spin at the same time.)

Great resource!  I saw that there is a chapter (20) on the standard transmission.  Was that available in cars destined to stay in Mexico?  Where else?  (I still distrust automatics.)

On 1/2/2023 at 1:29 PM, Puckrobber said:

Only family I have here is my kids and ex-wife in Choctaw. Had only lived in the Western part of the States before. With the exception of a few snags, it's nice to be here.

Here's a funny thing.  US 62 goes through near Choctaw, correct? (I think it goes through south east of where I grew up in north east Oklahoma, maybe through Muskogee?)  Anyway, it also goes through our little town here in Ohio (Berlin).  It's a highway I'd like to drive someday, all the way from Buffalo, NY down to Brownsville, TX.  (Once I can finish the restoration on my 46 Plymouth....)

5 hours ago, Puckrobber said:

I'm currently in Clinton (Custer County), about 86 miles west of Oklahoma City. Moved here in May from Arizona. Housing market wasn't working for us, so, we moved here to be closer to my kids.

My Dad grew up north of Enid, in the Kremlin & Hillsdale area.  My folks both graduated from the Corn Bible Academy (in Corn, OK), & I've been to church youth events in the Weatherford & Hydro area.  (My great grandfather was one of the original settlers in Corn, then spelled Korn.  Later they moved down to the Gotebo area, south of you.)  I have relatives in the Fairview area as well.

On 12/30/2022 at 12:43 AM, Locosiete said:

Call me cheap but couple zip ties and couple L brackets would work just as good

We bought our 2009 Journey used in Florida, a 'rear plate only' state, so it didn't have any holes drilled in the front bumper skin.  I just went the pull tie route, sort of planning to make a bracket that would fasten to the steel structure behind the grill, and stick through in order to fasten the tag in place.  But I never got it done, and a year or so back Ohio dropped the requirement for a front plate.  So when after years of use one of the pull ties broke, off it came.

4 hours ago, Puckrobber said:

Haven't driven the DJ in the snow yet. No snow in this part of Oklahoma yet. But, I always figure it's: put on proper tires, drive carefully, and know your limits. Been watching the news and seeing several multi-car pile-ups, due to people not slowing down or over-driving the vehicle they have. Just my 2 cents.

What part of Oklahoma are you from?  I grew up near the north edge of Tulsa County, not far from Washington County (Collinsville).  (And 16 miles west of Claremore.)

2009 FWD Journey, 4 banger.  Southern part of the Ohio 'Snow Belt" (I call this the salt belt. Holmes County hills.  Narrow back roads, sharp turns, steep assents & descents.)

That said, what I've noticed is that ABS works against you when attempting to slow down on a descent, down to a stop sign.  The Journey does better if I put it into Neutral as I come down to the stop sign at the end of our street.  (My wife just avoids that way leaving our street, and takes the round-about route out to the main road.)  This car does well in snow, I'd say.  But then I slow down for bad conditions.  I grew up in Oklahoma, where we had more ice covered roads than snow.  Remember one time on a trip back to Oklahoma - hit an ice storm in Missouri.  Put up in a motel early that Saturday afternoon, because the heater couldn't keep the ice off of the wipers.  Next morning went back out on the highway, and the ice was still all there.  Solid sheet.  Driving about 25 MPH.  A PU with a camper goes by at about 40, does a few donuts in front of us, down through the median, back up on the road, and away he went.  Didn't learn a solitary thing.

Anyway, never had problems with our Journey on packed snow here in Ohio.

16 hours ago, pixistick1605 said:

Hello to all.  I know this thread is a little old, but I wanted to add my findings to help someone out who may be searching online for an answer.  I had this very same issue on my 2016 Dodge Journey Crossroad.  After it rained, my car had a musty smell, soaked on driver's side (front and rear) and the rear driver's side storage bin would be full of water.  I finally took it to the local dealership today and was advised it was the "Plenum Chamber."  To have it replaced and including labor, it was $385 (South Florida) as that is not covered under my extended warranty.  It's supposed to rain here for the next 3 days so if the problem isn't resolved, I'll take it back to the dealer and advise.  If no updated post from me, the problem was fixed. 

 

I also want to note that the area at work that I park at has a LOT of trees.  

I didn't read over the entire thread so far, but I had a 2000 Chrysler T&C that would get soaked carpet like that.  It was the drain from the wiper stowage area.  Leaves fall in there, rot, then plug the tube that is supposed to drain water out of that area before it got high enough to get into that chamber of the heating-cooling system.  I could usually just pull the rubber drain tube off on the firewall, and the water would pour out.  There was always a lot of water in there before it would actually come in through there, into the cabin.  Then just had to run a wire through the drain tube to clear it.  (And try to remember to keep after it, before it soaked the carpet again.)  In my case, it would come pouring in just as I moved the car.  As it tilted to one side, then the water would come in on the low side.  Same deal with the trees - lots of pine needles in my case.

Get ready, people are probably going to jump down your back about wanting to disable the ABS.  I myself am inclined to agree that it sometimes does more damage than helps.  But maybe only if you learned to drive before they started putting that corruption on cars.  (At the intersection where our street enters the next larger street, it is a steep descent down to the stop sign.  They also rarely clear the snow & ice away out of the right side of the lane, and so the right tires are on snow or ice, while the left tires are on mostly dry pavement.  What I've experienced is that under these conditions, the ABS prevents me from easily stopping the car there, because it continually disengages the brakes on the left side, the tires on which I am depending to be able to stop.  I learned to drive way before ABS, and I can do better than this automatic system in knowing how much brake to use, and when to let off for a bit to regain traction.)

But sorry that I do not know the answer to your question, for this vehicle.  I had an off-brand (non-MoPar) PU that I pulled the ABS fuse, and it disabled the cruise as well.  In my case, I didn't need that anyway, because we live in the country, and in a county with mostly narrow, curvey dirt roads that go up & down steep hills.  So not a place for cruise.

Welcome.  I am an Okie in exile (Ohio).  Grew up north of Tulsa.

3 hours ago, 2late4u said:

My uncle up in Indiana worked at Ford motor company as a Boilermaker  and he Always bought just Fords and actually told his kids when they turned 16 that they could buy any vehicle they wanted BUT if it wasnt a Ford they couldn't park it in his driveway or yard, they would have to park it on the road in their neighborhood and since that wasnt allowed up there, they all drove fords.............To be honest i worked 30 yrs for Chrysler and during that time i only bought 1 new ford and the rest were always Dodge vehicles as well

My dad was a service department parts guy (that is, he served the mechanics, not the public) his whole life, and his work vehicle was almost always one made by the manufacturer serviced by the dealership where he worked.  But he never worked at any Ford place.  Chrysler Plymouth Dodge DeSoto starting out, a short stint at Pontiac, then Rambler.  The last place was 23 years at Oldsmobile.  He had a Rambler, but wasn't at Pontiac very long at all.

His Dad was a Ford guy, although he only ever owned 4 cars his whole life.  1925 Model T, 39 sedan, 49 sedan, and a 61, all Fords.

48 minutes ago, 5rebel9 said:

What year DJ and what are these steel rims from (and model). 

 On both our '11 and '14 the alloys are a little close with stock '17's  

Are your rims '16" steels?

I can't DEFINITIVELY say spacers and thickness will "fix you up". but with clean and smooth rotor hat and rim mount centers that 5 mm spacers will be ok to stay in place and not have loosening problems. I've only run one set of BP adapters on one car (of very many) in all my driving years and that was on a '72 VW Beetle.

Sorry about this, but I drifted off of the original topic, and onto an issue with a non-MoPar vehicle.  As a dyed-in-the-wool MoPar guy it hurts me to admit this, but we now own a 2019 Honda CR-V that was to replace the Journey.  (My Dad, who is gone now for almost 2 years, DID tell me once that he wouldn't disown me if we got a certain other make, the one that starts with an "F"....  That's what my wife's dad always had, with a few exceptions.)  I say "was to replace" because I haven't sold the Journey yet - I simply do not know how to sell a vehicle.  (I don't mean that in the technical sense, but more like "I cannot bring myself to part with it, other than through its eventual demise, probably at the hands of the "Salt Devil".  And my younger brother has the same "illness", and incidentally that's where my first car, a 62 Chrysler Newport, still sits, in the pasture behind his house.)

So this 5th Gen 2019 Honda CR-V EX-L came with 18" alloy wheels.  (Apparently none of that year's models came with steel wheels, and I cannot find any after-market steel wheels that say that they will fit this vehicle.  There seems to have been a design change in the middle of this generation, after the 2017 model.)  So the wheels I ended up with for the Blizzaks are 17" alloy OEM Honda wheels of uncertain year.  My best guess is that they are probably from 4th Gen Honda CR-Vs.  Honda talks in metric nonsense of course, but the lug pattern on these wheels is actually 5x4.5, the same as the 1993 2nd Gen Chrysler Town & Country on which I conducted a "mercy-killing" when it became evident that it was destined to a slow death at the hands of the aforementioned "Salt Devil".  Those wheels would probably fit without the caliper interference on the face area, but they are 15s, and the only tire I can find that is a close match to the 235/60R18 is a 235/65R17.  (Two additional tire rotations per mile.)

I read an article on Summit Racing about the hub-centric vs lug-centric controversy, where the author states that the hub plays no part in supporting the weight of the vehicle during operation.  (He says that it is friction alone, regardless of the wheel/hub design.)  Then a woman who claims to be qualified to speak on the matter wrote a long response, supporting the theory I had always thought to be correct, that the hub DOES support the wheel, unless it is designed as lug-centric.  (I have a small aluminum trailer (4x8, open box) with lug-centric hubs and wheels, and the lug bolts are of a larger diameter, which makes sense if they are depended on to support the weight, not the hub's machined outer surface. 

I will send a text message to the seller of the alloys, and see if he can tell me what vehicle these wheels came from.  (I didn't personally pick them up - my son-in-law needed to go down to that area, some 2 1/2 hours south of us, so I asked him to make the transaction.)

EDIT: My guess is that the 17" Honda alloy wheels would fit the 2017 and earlier CR-Vs, but I don't have one to test it on.

Another question:  What do you all think of running spacers on the front wheels?

(There is a bit of caliper interference, a bit less than 1/4".  The thinnest spacers are 5mm.  But this would push the wheel out far enough that the wheel would no longer engage the flange on the hub.  (So in my thinking, that would make it "lug bearing", not "hub bearing".  Not crazy about doing this.)

The result:  (If I posted these photos here already, in another thread, my apologies.)

Painted the centers (black) by hand, with a # 2 camel hair brush which I had trimmed a bit to get more of a point.  Not anywhere near perfect.  I'm not as steady with hand work as I was back when I was 1/3 my current age.

19 minutes ago, 5rebel9 said:

VERY NICE paint work on those hubcaps! My compliments

As for getting those "special lugnuts for them, YES Rock Auto is hard to beat even with some of the shipping prices they get roped into having to pass along with the parts cost. I use them exclusively for all my cars when able to "foresee" parts needs rather than going to the auto parts "box stores".

AND those lug nuts are NOT solely for the Journeys, they are the SAME ones our old 04 NEON used for hubcaps. In fact I have a bunch of them to match up to the set of rims and "caps"that I still have for it.

Do you still have an old Neon?  If anyone is interested, I have the bumper skin for a 98 model - free for anyone who can use it.  (That was the last year for that generation, correct?)  Also have 4 14" rims off of that same car.  (Had two sets, one with snow tires.  The tires were used on another vehicle, but still have the wheels.  Going to have to start getting rid of some things.  My wife already thinks I'm a pack rat, and "hoarder" is the next in line....)  Also have a (white) right front fender for that 98. 

[The deal was that we bought that car for our daughter to get to & from school.  Then someone hit her, and although the other insurance company totaled it, being an older vehicle it wasn't badly damaged at all.  I was going to fix it, but then after it left her sitting once time, she didn't trust it anymore.  Then after I bought this bumper skin I was talking about, I found out that although I had the VIN info off of the salvage car I got the parts from, there was no VIN tag on the bumper, and after reading what I'd have to do ti get a title again, I got "scared" that they'd confiscate the car, as it says in the state handbook.  So I let the insurance company take it anyway.  A friend who rebuilds newer salvage cars later told me they very seldom actually investigate the replacement parts, and especially not on one that old, but it was long gone by then.]